# An Interview with MG (Mike Grover)

- Show: [The Amp Hour](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour)
- Published: 2019-08-12
- Length: 52m
- Episode: 454
- Page: https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2019-08-12-an-interview-with-mg-mike-grover
- Listen: https://theamphour.com/the-amp-hour-454-mike-grover/

## Summary

Security researcher Mike Grover (MG) explains how he creates cable implants by milling tiny PCBs with an OXO mill to fit inside USB cables. He details the process of designing minimal HID attack circuits using ATtiny microcontrollers and the challenges of home-reflowing BGA components on ultra-thin FR-4 boards. Grover discusses the shift from wired to wireless implants and the importance of rapid iteration in hardware security research.

## Chapters

- [0:00](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2019-08-12-an-interview-with-mg-mike-grover#t=0) Introduction and Cable Implants
- [3:32](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2019-08-12-an-interview-with-mg-mike-grover#t=212) HID Attacks and Red Teaming
- [14:17](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2019-08-12-an-interview-with-mg-mike-grover#t=857) Prototyping with ATtiny and DigiSpark
- [22:00](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2019-08-12-an-interview-with-mg-mike-grover#t=1320) PCB Milling and Solder Mask Techniques
- [32:17](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2019-08-12-an-interview-with-mg-mike-grover#t=1937) Miniaturization and BGA Reflow
- [44:35](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2019-08-12-an-interview-with-mg-mike-grover#t=2675) Wireless Implants and Future Attacks
- [48:02](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2019-08-12-an-interview-with-mg-mike-grover#t=2882) Soldering with Spoons and Conclusion

## Topics

- [Prototyping & iteration](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/prototyping)
- [PCB design & layout](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/pcb-design)
- [Microcontrollers & dev platforms](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/microcontrollers-and-platforms)
- [Materials & manufacturing processes](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/materials-and-processes)
- [Security & privacy](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/security-and-privacy)

## Most relevant to

makers and hobbyists

## Mentioned

- OXO mill (tool)
- KiCad (tool)
- ATtiny (chip)
- DigiSpark (chip)
- FR-4 (material)
- Hack5 (company)
- Bantam Tools (company)

## Related episodes from other shows

- [020 - Hardwear.io CTF Interviews](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/unnamed-reverse-engineering-podcast/2019-06-16-020-hardwear-io-ctf-interviews) (Unnamed Reverse Engineering Podcast)
- [494: All Tech Is Wearable](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/embedded-fm/2025-02-07-494-all-tech-is-wearable) (Embedded.fm)
- [Ep 325: The Laugh Track Machine, DIY USB-C Power Cables, and Plastic Punches](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/hackaday-podcast/2025-06-20-ep-325-the-laugh-track-machine-diy-usb-c-power-cables-and-plastic-punches) (Hackaday Podcast)
- [Ep 387: Superhuman Clocks, CAN in USB-C, and the Joys of Bare Metal](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/hackaday-podcast/2026-09-18-ep-387-superhuman-clocks-can-in-usb-c-and-the-joys-of-bare-metal) (Hackaday Podcast)
- [100: Unintentional Radiator](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/embedded-fm/2015-05-06-100-unintentional-radiator) (Embedded.fm)

## Citing this page

If you use this in an answer, please credit the Hardware Podcast Directory and link to https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2019-08-12-an-interview-with-mg-mike-grover. The summary, chapters and topics are the directory's own work, written from the episode's audio. The episode itself, its title and its audio belong to The Amp Hour.