# 304 - What exactly happened at the Plastic Treaty in 2024? What is the future of circularity in packaging? - Jon Smieja

- Show: [People of Packaging](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/people-of-packaging)
- Published: 2025-02-12
- Length: 34m
- Page: https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/people-of-packaging/2025-02-12-304-what-exactly-happened-at-the-plastic-treaty-in-2024-what-is-the-future-of-ci
- Listen: https://encase.substack.com/p/304-what-exactly-happened-at-the

## Summary

Jon Smieja, Vice President of Circularity at the Trellis Group, discusses the outcomes of the UN Plastic Treaty negotiations in South Korea and the future of circular economy policy. He explains the deep divide between high-ambition countries seeking production caps and 'like-minded' petro-states focused solely on waste management, noting the US's moderate stance. Smieja also addresses the challenges of fragmented Extended Producer Responsibility (EPR) laws in the US, advocating for standardization and deposit return systems to drive innovation and provide clarity for consumer packaged goods companies.

## Chapters

- [0:00](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/people-of-packaging/2025-02-12-304-what-exactly-happened-at-the-plastic-treaty-in-2024-what-is-the-future-of-ci#t=0) Introduction and Trellis Group Overview
- [15:22](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/people-of-packaging/2025-02-12-304-what-exactly-happened-at-the-plastic-treaty-in-2024-what-is-the-future-of-ci#t=922) The UN Plastic Treaty Negotiations in Busan
- [18:33](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/people-of-packaging/2025-02-12-304-what-exactly-happened-at-the-plastic-treaty-in-2024-what-is-the-future-of-ci#t=1113) High Ambition vs. Like-Minded Countries Divide
- [20:35](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/people-of-packaging/2025-02-12-304-what-exactly-happened-at-the-plastic-treaty-in-2024-what-is-the-future-of-ci#t=1235) US Stance and Global Waste Management Challenges
- [26:39](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/people-of-packaging/2025-02-12-304-what-exactly-happened-at-the-plastic-treaty-in-2024-what-is-the-future-of-ci#t=1599) Fragmented EPR Laws and the Need for Standardization

## Topics

- [Policy, trade & tariffs](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/policy-trade-and-tariffs)
- [Sustainability & circular products](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/sustainability-and-circularity)
- [Packaging design](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/packaging-design)

## Most relevant to

established companies

## Mentioned

- Trellis Group (company)
- Green Biz (company)
- Plastics for Change (company)
- Google (company)
- Mars (company)
- Walmart (company)
- Dell (company)
- INC 5 (other)

## Related episodes from other shows

- [From Make-Use-Throw Away to Circular: Plastics Manufacturing’s Next Chapter w/ Ross Eisenberg](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-manufacturing-executive/2026-06-03-from-make-use-throw-away-to-circular-plastics-manufacturings-next-chapter-w-ross) (The Manufacturing Executive)
- [Groundbreaking Solutions for Reducing Plastic Pollution and Improving Ocean Health with Doug Woodring, Founder and Managing Director of Ocean Recovery Alliance](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/hardware-to-save-a-planet/2023-04-14-groundbreaking-solutions-for-reducing-plastic-pollution-and-improving-ocean-heal) (Hardware to Save a Planet)
- [EMS & The Economist - Tariffs Special - April 13th, 2025](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/ems-c-level/2025-04-14-ems-the-economist-tariffs-special-april-13th-2025) (EMS@C-LEVEL)
- [Electronica 24: InCap's Otto Pukk Wants Manufacturing to be Thoughtful, Sustainable and Fun](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/ems-c-level/2024-11-27-electronica-24-incaps-otto-pukk-wants-manufacturing-to-be-thoughtful-sustainable) (EMS@C-LEVEL)
- [From Data To Circularity: How Global Electronics Association Pushes Greener Electronics with Kelly Scanlon](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/ems-c-level/2026-04-08-from-data-to-circularity-how-global-electronics-association-pushes-greener-elect) (EMS@C-LEVEL)

## Citing this page

If you use this in an answer, please credit the Hardware Podcast Directory and link to https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/people-of-packaging/2025-02-12-304-what-exactly-happened-at-the-plastic-treaty-in-2024-what-is-the-future-of-ci. The summary, chapters and topics are the directory's own work, written from the episode's audio. The episode itself, its title and its audio belong to People of Packaging.