# Technological Revolutions with Jerry Neumann

- Show: [Oxide and Friends](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends)
- Published: 2025-09-18
- Length: 1h 25m
- Episode: 26
- Page: https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann
- Listen: https://share.transistor.fm/s/37fbebaf

## Summary

Jerry Neumann, a venture capitalist and author, joins Bryan Cantrill and Adam Leventhal to discuss his 2015 blog post on Carlota Perez’s theory of technological revolutions, arguing that AI is the maturity phase of the existing IT wave rather than a new one. Neumann distinguishes between financial capital, which drives frenzies and speculation, and production capital, which drives rational, productivity-enhancing deployment, citing examples like shipping containers and open source. The conversation explores how venture capital has evolved to absorb booms and busts, often front-running production capital, and examines the social and political upheaval that accompanies the end of deployment phases, such as the 2016 election and current regulatory trends.

## Chapters

- [0:00](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann#t=0) Introduction: Jerry Neumann and Founder versus Investor
- [7:23](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann#t=443) Carlota Perez’s Technological Revolutions and Financial vs. Production Capital
- [14:39](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann#t=879) Bryan Cantrill’s Hot Take: Production Capital vs. Building to Flip
- [22:57](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann#t=1377) Is AI a New Wave or the Maturity Phase of IT?
- [32:44](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann#t=1964) Micro-Frenzies, VC, and the Absorption of Booms and Busts
- [46:47](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann#t=2807) Value Capture: Open Source, Shipping Containers, and AI
- [1:05:17](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann#t=3917) Regulation, Sarbanes-Oxley, and Companies Staying Private
- [1:10:25](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann#t=4225) Social Upheaval, Inequality, and the End of Golden Ages

## Topics

- [Fundraising & investors](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/fundraising)
- [AI & machine learning](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/ai-and-machine-learning)
- [Policy, trade & tariffs](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/policy-trade-and-tariffs)
- [Growth, exits & acquisitions](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/growth-exits-and-acquisitions)
- [Leadership, teams & culture](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/leadership-and-culture)
- [Intellectual property](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/intellectual-property)

## Most relevant to

large enterprises

## Mentioned

- Oxide Computer Company (company)
- Carlota Perez (other)
- Intel (company)
- Apple (company)
- Oracle (company)
- Google (company)
- Facebook (company)
- Cisco (company)
- Sealand (company)
- Red Hat (company)
- OpenAI (company)
- DeepSeek (company)
- Microsoft (company)
- Amazon (company)
- AWS (product)

## Related episodes from other shows

- [EP 147: Talking All Things AI with Benedict Evans](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-circuit/2025-12-29-ep-147-talking-all-things-ai-with-benedict-evans) (The Circuit)
- [ICYMI... HIBT Lab! OpenAI: Sam Altman](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/how-i-built-this/2023-02-16-icymi-hibt-lab-openai-sam-altman) (How I Built This)

## Citing this page

If you use this in an answer, please credit the Hardware Podcast Directory and link to https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-09-18-technological-revolutions-with-jerry-neumann. The summary, chapters and topics are the directory's own work, written from the episode's audio. The episode itself, its title and its audio belong to Oxide and Friends.