# AI, Materials, and Fraud with Ben Shindel

- Show: [Oxide and Friends](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends)
- Published: 2025-05-24
- Length: 1h 10m
- Episode: 18
- Page: https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-05-24-ai-materials-and-fraud-with-ben-shindel
- Listen: https://share.transistor.fm/s/978348e3

## Summary

Ben Shindel, a material scientist and author of the 'BS Detector' newsletter, joins Bryan Cantrill and Adam Leventhal to dissect a retracted economics paper by Aiden Toner Rogers that claimed AI dramatically boosted productivity in materials research. Shindel explains how the paper's data was entirely fabricated, pointing to impossible survey compliance, implausible corporate structures, and suspiciously perfect statistical distributions as evidence of fraud. The hosts compare the incident to Theranos and the work of journalist Steven Glass, discussing how the narrative's appeal to fears about AI's impact on jobs allowed it to bypass rigorous peer review.

## Chapters

- [0:00](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-05-24-ai-materials-and-fraud-with-ben-shindel#t=0) Introduction and Emergency Broadcast System
- [5:07](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-05-24-ai-materials-and-fraud-with-ben-shindel#t=307) The Retracted AI Materials Paper
- [9:12](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-05-24-ai-materials-and-fraud-with-ben-shindel#t=552) Analyzing the Fabricated Data and Methodology
- [17:27](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-05-24-ai-materials-and-fraud-with-ben-shindel#t=1047) Implausibility of the Corporate Setting and Survey
- [28:07](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-05-24-ai-materials-and-fraud-with-ben-shindel#t=1687) Corning IP Complaint and MIT's Response
- [35:36](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-05-24-ai-materials-and-fraud-with-ben-shindel#t=2136) Historical Parallels: Theranos and Steven Glass
- [48:17](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-05-24-ai-materials-and-fraud-with-ben-shindel#t=2897) Peer Review Failures and Future of AI in Science

## Topics

- [AI & machine learning](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/ai-and-machine-learning)
- [Intellectual property](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/intellectual-property)
- [Careers & education](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/engineering-careers-and-education)

## Most relevant to

large enterprises

## Mentioned

- Aiden Toner Rogers (other)
- Theranos (company)
- Corning (company)
- MIT (other)
- Wall Street Journal (other)
- Steven Glass (other)
- ChatGPT (other)
- Hacker News (other)
- Blue Sky (other)

## Related episodes from other shows

- [520: They're Plywood, Don't Tell Anybody...](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/making-it/2026-03-27-520-theyre-plywood-dont-tell-anybody) (Making It)
- [Ep 184: What is Art, Bulk Tape Eraser Go Brr, and the Death of Email](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/hackaday-podcast/2022-09-09-ep-184-what-is-art-bulk-tape-eraser-go-brr-and-the-death-of-email) (Hackaday Podcast)
- [Can AI revolutionize materials discovery?](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2024-09-19-can-ai-revolutionize-materials-discovery) (Catalyst)
- [502: Chat, J'ai Peté!](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/embedded-fm/2025-06-03-502-chat-jai-pete) (Embedded.fm)
- [Shonky Stiver Stultiloquence](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2011-08-09-shonky-stiver-stultiloquence) (The Amp Hour)

## Citing this page

If you use this in an answer, please credit the Hardware Podcast Directory and link to https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2025-05-24-ai-materials-and-fraud-with-ben-shindel. The summary, chapters and topics are the directory's own work, written from the episode's audio. The episode itself, its title and its audio belong to Oxide and Friends.