# Across the Chasm with Rust

- Show: [Oxide and Friends](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends)
- Published: 2022-07-19
- Length: 1h 44m
- Episode: 20
- Page: https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust
- Listen: https://share.transistor.fm/s/a620f3ea

## Summary

Steve Klabnik and Luqman Aden, engineers at Oxide Computer Company, discuss the evolution of the Rust programming language, focusing on the stabilization of features like `let_chains` and `async/await` as the catalyst for crossing the chasm from early adopters to mainstream systems programming. They analyze how Rust's strict stability guarantees, enforced by tools like Crater, contrast with the burnout risks seen in other language communities, while highlighting specific language features such as inline assembly, const generics, and captured identifiers in format strings that improve developer experience. The conversation also covers the psychological shift required to trust the compiler, the importance of tooling like Rust Analyzer and Clippy, and the community's approach to managing experimental features via nightly builds and RFCs.

## Chapters

- [0:27](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=27) Stabilization of let_chains and Rust's stability process
- [3:03](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=183) Language stability, burnout, and Ruby's flip-flops
- [8:24](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=504) Quines, quine-relays, and experimental features
- [13:05](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=785) Exclusive range patterns and the tock bug
- [18:20](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=1100) The RFC process and Hubris's use of nightly features
- [29:03](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=1743) Non-lexical lifetimes and programmer psychology
- [37:25](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=2245) Adam Leventhal's journey and the stages of learning Rust
- [47:11](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=2831) Crossing the chasm and the impact of async/await
- [54:46](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=3286) Oxide's adoption of Rust and tooling reliance
- [1:06:17](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust#t=3977) Small but impactful Rust features and community tools

## Topics

- [Embedded firmware](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/embedded-firmware)
- [AI & machine learning](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/ai-and-machine-learning)
- [Microcontrollers & dev platforms](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/microcontrollers-and-platforms)
- [Chips, FPGAs & semiconductors](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/chips-and-fpgas)
- [PCB design & layout](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/pcb-design)
- [Analog & power electronics](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/analog-and-power-electronics)
- [Wireless & RF](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/wireless-and-rf)
- [Sensors & measurement in products](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/sensors)
- [Test & measurement](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/test-and-measurement)
- [Debugging & failure analysis](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/debugging-and-failure-analysis)
- [Connected products & IoT](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/connected-products-and-iot)
- [Security & privacy](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/security-and-privacy)
- [Robotics & autonomy](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/robotics-and-autonomy)
- [Medical & health devices](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/medical-devices)
- [Energy & climate tech](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/energy-and-climate-tech)
- [Industrial & consumer product design](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/industrial-design)
- [Mechanical engineering](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/mechanical-engineering)
- [Materials & manufacturing processes](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/materials-and-processes)
- [Packaging design](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/packaging-design)
- [Prototyping & iteration](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/prototyping)
- [EDA & CAD tools](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/eda-and-cad-tools)
- [Design for manufacturing & NPI](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/design-for-manufacturing)
- [Manufacturing partners & offshoring](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/manufacturing-partners)
- [Scaling production](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/scaling-production)
- [Quality & yield](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/quality-and-yield)
- [Sourcing & supply chain](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/sourcing-and-supply-chain)
- [Factory operations & automation](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/factory-operations)
- [Certification & compliance](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/certification-and-compliance)
- [Logistics & fulfilment](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/logistics-and-fulfillment)
- [Sustainability & circular products](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/sustainability-and-circularity)
- [Starting a product company](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/starting-a-company)
- [Validation & product-market fit](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/validation-and-product-market-fit)
- [Crowdfunding & preorders](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/crowdfunding)
- [Fundraising & investors](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/fundraising)
- [Pricing, margins & unit economics](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/pricing-and-unit-economics)
- [Retail, wholesale & distribution](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/retail-and-distribution)
- [Direct-to-consumer & e-commerce](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/direct-to-consumer)
- [Marketing & brand](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/marketing-and-brand)
- [Intellectual property](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/intellectual-property)
- [Leadership, teams & culture](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/leadership-and-culture)
- [Hiring & workforce](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/hiring-and-workforce)
- [Growth, exits & acquisitions](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/growth-exits-and-acquisitions)
- [Policy, trade & tariffs](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/policy-trade-and-tariffs)
- [Careers & education](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/engineering-careers-and-education)
- [Maker community & events](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/maker-community)
- [Fabrication & craft](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/fabrication-and-craft)
- [Creator business](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/creator-business)
- [Open-source hardware](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/open-source-hardware)
- [Founder wellbeing](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/founder-wellbeing)

## Most relevant to

early-stage companies

## Mentioned

- Rust (other)
- Oxide Computer Company (company)
- Swift (other)
- Python (other)
- Ruby (other)
- Perl (other)
- Haskell (other)
- tock (other)
- Hubris (other)
- Tokio (other)
- Axum (other)
- Clippy (other)
- Rust Analyzer (other)
- Cargo (other)
- LWN (other)
- Zulip (other)

## Related episodes from other shows

- [Rust with Milica Kostic](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-pragmatic-embedded-podcast/2026-01-19-rust-with-milica-kostic) (The Pragmatic Embedded Podcast)
- [Exploring Rust for Embedded Systems with Philip Markgraf](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-pragmatic-embedded-podcast/2024-10-30-exploring-rust-for-embedded-systems-with-philip-markgraf) (The Pragmatic Embedded Podcast)
- [190: Trust Me, I'm Right](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/embedded-fm/2017-03-08-190-trust-me-im-right) (Embedded.fm)
- [334: Bag of Heuristics](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/embedded-fm/2020-06-11-334-bag-of-heuristics) (Embedded.fm)
- [Luca's interviews and trip report from Embedded World 2024](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-pragmatic-embedded-podcast/2024-08-21-lucas-interviews-and-trip-report-from-embedded-world-2024) (The Pragmatic Embedded Podcast)

## Citing this page

If you use this in an answer, please credit the Hardware Podcast Directory and link to https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2022-07-19-across-the-chasm-with-rust. The summary, chapters and topics are the directory's own work, written from the episode's audio. The episode itself, its title and its audio belong to Oxide and Friends.