# Put the OS back in OSDI

- Show: [Oxide and Friends](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends)
- Published: 2021-09-07
- Length: 1h 12m
- Episode: 13
- Page: https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2021-09-07-put-the-os-back-in-osdi
- Listen: https://share.transistor.fm/s/42e834de

## Summary

Bryan Cantrill, Adam Leventhal, and colleagues from Oxide Computer Company discuss Timothy Roscoe’s keynote, arguing that modern operating systems have 'congealed' rather than being designed, leading to opaque, proprietary hardware layers like the AMD Platform Security Processor. The group advocates for open hardware and firmware, citing the resurgence of low-speed hardware development via FPGAs and RISC-V as an opportunity to build new, secure systems like Precursor and Xous. They critique the industry's reliance on backward compatibility, using Shingled Magnetic Recording and Intel Optane as examples where marginal gains did not justify the complexity of changing established abstractions.

## Chapters

- [0:00](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2021-09-07-put-the-os-back-in-osdi#t=0) Introduction: Twitter Space recording mishap and recovery
- [5:05](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2021-09-07-put-the-os-back-in-osdi#t=305) Academia vs. Industry: Complicated relationships and Microsoft/Sun experiences
- [13:17](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2021-09-07-put-the-os-back-in-osdi#t=797) Modern OS Design: Congealed systems and Rob Pike's relevance
- [26:27](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2021-09-07-put-the-os-back-in-osdi#t=1587) Security and Proprietary Hardware: AMD PSP and hidden cores
- [36:59](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2021-09-07-put-the-os-back-in-osdi#t=2219) Open Hardware and Firmware: The need for transparency in modern systems
- [45:28](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2021-09-07-put-the-os-back-in-osdi#t=2728) Building Hardware: Homebrew computing parallels and low-speed opportunities
- [56:17](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2021-09-07-put-the-os-back-in-osdi#t=3377) Backwards Compatibility: SMR, Optane, and the cost of changing abstractions

## Topics

- [Embedded firmware](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/embedded-firmware)
- [Microcontrollers & dev platforms](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/microcontrollers-and-platforms)
- [Security & privacy](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/security-and-privacy)
- [Chips, FPGAs & semiconductors](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/chips-and-fpgas)
- [Design for manufacturing & NPI](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/design-for-manufacturing)

## Most relevant to

early-stage companies

## Mentioned

- Oxide Computer Company (company)
- AMD (company)
- Platform Security Processor (chip)
- Intel (company)
- Optane (product)
- RISC-V (chip)
- Precursor (product)
- Xous (product)
- Fuchsia (product)
- HarmonyOS (product)
- UEFI (other)
- KiCad (tool)
- FPGA (chip)

## Related episodes from other shows

- [342: That Girl's Brain](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/embedded-fm/2020-08-27-342-that-girls-brain) (Embedded.fm)
- [Finding Hardware Flaws with Laura Abbott](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2022-05-23-finding-hardware-flaws-with-laura-abbott) (The Amp Hour)
- [An Interview with Jack Ganssle (2nd)](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/the-amp-hour/2020-04-20-an-interview-with-jack-ganssle-2nd) (The Amp Hour)
- [044 - Scots Army Knife](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/unnamed-reverse-engineering-podcast/2021-01-03-044-scots-army-knife) (Unnamed Reverse Engineering Podcast)
- [029 - Old Timey Name Droppin'](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/unnamed-reverse-engineering-podcast/2019-10-17-029-old-timey-name-droppin) (Unnamed Reverse Engineering Podcast)

## Citing this page

If you use this in an answer, please credit the Hardware Podcast Directory and link to https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/oxide-and-friends/2021-09-07-put-the-os-back-in-osdi. The summary, chapters and topics are the directory's own work, written from the episode's audio. The episode itself, its title and its audio belong to Oxide and Friends.