# The Carbon Copy: A rogue geoengineering startup sparks worry

- Show: [Catalyst](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst)
- Published: 2023-04-27
- Length: 26m
- Page: https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry

## Summary

Time staff writer Alejandro de la Garza profiles Make Sunsets, a rogue startup founded by Luke Iseman and Andrew Song, which is attempting to implement solar geoengineering by launching weather balloons filled with sulfur dioxide into the stratosphere. Experts Dr. Kevin Surprise and Dr. Holly Buck criticize the company's unverified 'cooling credits' and warn that their uncoordinated, illegal launches risk delegitimizing the entire field of geoengineering while creating unpredictable environmental and geopolitical consequences. The episode highlights the tension between academic caution and the 'move fast and break things' mentality of Silicon Valley entrepreneurs who are pushing the technology from theoretical debate into uncontrolled real-world experiments.

## Chapters

- [0:00](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=0) Introduction: Catalyst and The Carbon Copy crossover
- [1:58](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=118) Make Sunsets founders Luke Iseman and Andrew Song's hotel room SO2 experiments
- [4:55](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=295) The illegal Reno balloon launch using fungicide and garbage bags
- [7:35](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=455) Sponsor reads: Energy Hub, Bloom Energy, and NG Resources
- [8:06](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=486) Solar geoengineering defined: Stratospheric aerosol injection and risks
- [10:32](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=632) Profile of Make Sunsets founders: Luke Iseman and Andrew Song
- [12:53](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=773) Make Sunsets' 'cooling credits' business model and scientific skepticism
- [14:17](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=857) Expert consensus: Why the scientific community opposes Make Sunsets
- [15:32](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=932) Dr. Holly Buck on the danger of delegitimizing geoengineering research
- [18:11](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=1091) Moral hazard, climate effects, and the inability to stop once started
- [22:45](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2023-04-27-the-carbon-copy-a-rogue-geoengineering-startup-sparks-worry#t=1365) Make Sunsets as performance art and the shift in geoengineering governance

## Topics

- [Energy & climate tech](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/energy-and-climate-tech)
- [Starting a product company](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/starting-a-company)
- [Policy, trade & tariffs](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/policy-trade-and-tariffs)
- [Validation & product-market fit](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/validation-and-product-market-fit)

## Most relevant to

founders before launch

## Mentioned

- Make Sunsets (company)
- Luke Iseman (other)
- Andrew Song (other)
- Alejandro de la Garza (other)
- Kevin Surprise (other)
- Holly Buck (other)
- Y Combinator (company)
- Energy Hub (company)

## Related episodes from other shows

- [Stratospheric Mirrors from Aerosol Injections: Make Sunsets' Approach to Cooling Earth](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/hardware-to-save-a-planet/2025-03-13-stratospheric-mirrors-from-aerosol-injections-make-sunsets-approach-to-cooling-e) (Hardware to Save a Planet)

## Citing this page

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