# Is nuclear fusion getting close?

- Show: [Catalyst](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst)
- Published: 2021-12-23
- Length: 47m
- Page: https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2021-12-23-is-nuclear-fusion-getting-close

## Summary

Dr. Scott Hsu, ARPA-E’s program director for fusion R&D, explains that recent technical milestones, such as the National Ignition Facility’s 1.3 MJ yield, and massive funding rounds for startups like General Fusion, Helion Energy, and Commonwealth Fusion Systems, signal a shift in the fusion landscape. He details the physics of achieving scientific break-even and wall-plug gain, noting that while private companies are accelerating timelines using new superconductors and advanced manufacturing, significant challenges remain in scaling to economic viability. Hsu argues that fusion’s role will likely be in high-density, high-cost markets like Singapore and Japan, rather than displacing renewables entirely, with a target cost of under $50/MWh.

## Chapters

- [0:08](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2021-12-23-is-nuclear-fusion-getting-close#t=8) Introduction: Scott Hsu and the Fusion Landscape
- [4:17](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2021-12-23-is-nuclear-fusion-getting-close#t=257) Defining Fusion: Abundance, Density, and Waste
- [8:13](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2021-12-23-is-nuclear-fusion-getting-close#t=493) History of Fusion: From Tokamaks to ITER
- [18:40](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2021-12-23-is-nuclear-fusion-getting-close#t=1120) Fusion Pathways: Tokamaks, Inertial Confinement, and Z-Pinch
- [27:26](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2021-12-23-is-nuclear-fusion-getting-close#t=1646) Scientific Break-Even vs. Wall-Plug Gain
- [33:40](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2021-12-23-is-nuclear-fusion-getting-close#t=2020) Technical Challenges: Duration, First Wall, and Tritium
- [35:48](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2021-12-23-is-nuclear-fusion-getting-close#t=2148) Economics and Market Role: Capex, LCOE, and Flexibility
- [41:00](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/catalyst/2021-12-23-is-nuclear-fusion-getting-close#t=2460) National Ignition Facility Record and Future Outlook

## Topics

- [Energy & climate tech](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/energy-and-climate-tech)
- [Mechanical engineering](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/mechanical-engineering)
- [Scaling production](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/scaling-production)
- [Fundraising & investors](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/topic/fundraising)

## Most relevant to

early-stage companies

## Mentioned

- National Ignition Facility (other)
- General Fusion (company)
- Helion Energy (company)
- Commonwealth Fusion Systems (company)
- Zap Energy (company)
- Energy Impact Partners (company)
- ITER (other)
- JET (other)
- Sandia National Labs (company)
- ARPA-E (company)

## Related episodes from other shows

- [The Fuss About Fusion](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/ee-times-current/2021-12-10-the-fuss-about-fusion) (EE Times Current)
- [Igniting the Future: Fusion Power and the Road to Clean Energy with Scott Mercer](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/hardware-to-save-a-planet/2025-04-10-igniting-the-future-fusion-power-and-the-road-to-clean-energy-with-scott-mercer) (Hardware to Save a Planet)
- [Commercial Fusion Has Started: How Helion Is Bringing Power to the Grid by 2028](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/hardware-to-save-a-planet/2026-02-05-commercial-fusion-has-started-how-helion-is-bringing-power-to-the-grid-by-2028) (Hardware to Save a Planet)
- [The Future of Energy - Part 3: Fusion Energy](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/additive-snack/2022-08-30-the-future-of-energy-part-3-fusion-energy) (Additive Snack)
- [From Solar’s 90% Cost Crash to AI’s Energy Surge: The Economics Driving Climate Tech](https://hardwarepodcasts.com/podcast/hardware-to-save-a-planet/2025-09-16-from-solars-90-cost-crash-to-ais-energy-surge-the-economics-driving-climate-tech) (Hardware to Save a Planet)

## Citing this page

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